Supernatural 5x02

[katikat]

I can't believe that they went there, that they actually separated Sam and Dean, that Dean didn't protest when Sam suggested it... Sam's face, his broken expression when Dean simply agreed. I mean, I'm a Dean!girl but I'm not sure if I like Dean's reaction, his attitude. Sam needs help and instead of helping him, Dean's pulling the ground further from under Sam's feet...

But Rufus! Jo! Ellen! Bobby! Castiel! Awesome music!

And Dean's amulet! Eeeeeeeee! \o/

Comments

[astri13.livejournal.com]

As I said, to me, he feels all whatever where Sam's concerned. I didn't see him hurt, just cold and pissed off.

We'll have to agree to disagree there.

And I can't respect that. Dean has become John, the hunt more important than family, and intensely disliked John.

If he was all "I don't care about the apokalypse because I have to hold my brother's hand", I wouldn't think much of him. John left his kids alone for regular hunts, that is not the same thing to me.

I always liked that for Dean, family came first.

I think he went way, way too far in it. And meanwhile his family felt perfectly fine putting themselves first - John in an unhealthy way and Sam in a healthy way - so why can they do it and Dean can't? Kinda makes him the chump of that family.

Fine, he'll stop the apocalypse - but if he comes out on the other end realizing that he doesn't have anything left, will he find that worth it?

Not stopping the apokalypse means anybody is going to die or turn into demons anyway, including Sam and him so it should be worth it, no matter the personal cost to him, yes.

[katikat.livejournal.com]

I think he went way, way too far in it.

I never thought so, I never thought that he went too far. He did what he could to keep his family together. Yeah, they had big problems and faced huge obstacles - but together. And that's why I connected with him. This Dean... I don't recognize him and I'm not sure if I even like him. He's turning into John and I hated John. The hunt is everything, no matter the cost to the family. And that's not the Dean that I fell in love with.

[astri13.livejournal.com]

Again, we'll probably have to agree to disagree. For a lot of it, I felt he was the family's doormat and I wanted him to stand up for himself a bit. I loved him more despite of that then because of it.

Sam got lauded for doing the healthy thing for himself by going to Stanford while for the first two Seasons a lot of people looked down on Dean as the clingy, over-protective mess who didn't respect his brother enough to be his own man. Now he does and he does make healthy decisions like Sam did. Why is it so horrible when he does it? He puts the apokalypse, the big picture first. That is not John to me, that is a grown-up Dean.

[katikat.livejournal.com]

That is not John to me, that is a grown-up Dean.

Unfortunately, I didn't see it that way. Instead of dealing with the issues he has with Sam, he avoided them by going separate ways. Mature behavior would be, IMHO, saying no, enough running, we will stick together and actually deal for once like adults. He's doing exactly what John did - no boys, I can't take you with me, I can't worry about you etc. etc., I have to go alone and face the bad guy. Also, his behavior kinda reminds me of Sam in S4, when he told Ruby that he wanted to hunt without Dean because Dean was weak. Now Dean is saying that he can't hunt with Sam because Sam might slip again.

[astri13.livejournal.com]

Mature behavior would be, IMHO, saying no, enough running, we will stick together and actually deal for once like adults.

I think adults can and should take breaks in their relationships when they feel it prudent. It is often better to get some space and perspective than to force it by remaining together no matter what.

That's kinda what they did in Season 4, trying to force themselves together and it didn't work. I wanted them to split for a while at certain points there.

Now Dean is saying that he can't hunt with Sam because Sam might slip again.

And so does Sam. The last thing Sam should be around is demons and their blood constantly. Of course he has a high risk of slipping up there. I would think that, too if I were either Dean or Sam.

And it's clearly not forever. The new ep synopsis already seems to tuck a neat little bow to it all. I already imagine I will feel more cheated if they just smish them easily together again or have "epiphany" episodes where Sam loses his newfound perspective and Dean loses his newfound balls and then they are right back where they started.

[kirusai.livejournal.com]

Sorry, jumping in with my 2 cents as I just read your entire conversation.

I have to agree with astri in that adults in relationships whether it's family ties, platonic, or romantic, must learn to step back and take breaks. It doesn't mean you don't care.

You just get to a point where the conversation goes in circles, neither side gets their point across, both sides feeling burnt. The best course of action would be to take some distance, cool off, then talk.

There's no way you can talk things out when emotions are running high.

Also, I agree with you, astri, that Dean's finally learning to see he's worth something, that's he's living for himself and finally growing up.

[katikat.livejournal.com]

If this was One Three Hill, I would readily agree with you. But on Supernatural? With THE apocalypse on your butt? With both sides gunning for you and knowing that Sam is the only leverage against you? You let your brother walk away without even asking where to find him if you need it? Didn't they learn anything at all from their past mistakes? What did they think would happen once the demons, angels, Hell, Lucifer himself found out that you went your separate ways? And they will find out because they always seem to know everything about the Winchesters. Bad mojo happens when they split, every frickin' time, and they do it again! I mean, even Jack asked Daniel where he was going when Daniel went all glowy on SG-1 and Dean doesn't ask his only brother? It's so OOC that I couldn't believe it. Dean's new found detachment aside, ~I~ wouldn't let my own family simply walk away without asking them where they are going.